SPOILERS LTD Remake — It's like New Coke except ... no, it's exactly like New Coke

[pxl_pushr]

Tell me you don't accept FF7 Compilation without telling me you don't accept FF7 Compilation.

UItimate red flag.

Legit "I prefer to use bad translated material"

Are these the same people who also unironically claim to be OG purists? Rejecting CC’s expanded characterization of Aerith and Zack , for example? Because my brain always freezes at that absurd combo of positions.

 

[ViolaaFox]

Even in FF2 there was one comment at the end of the game to hint at Maria's feelings for Firion. And what do you know, they apparently become a couple in a novelisation.

Have people ever questioned Squal x Rinoa? As Rinoa was into Seifer before. Because I always had the impression that it's just CT that gets over overanalysed.

Someone calling her Aeris is always a red flag for me. I always think "well, you're not even willing to accept that her name is not what you thought it was, if you're that anal about not accepting reality why should I trust any thing you say?"

It gives me "I'm not like the average FFVII fan" vibes. They love the OG so much that they are even willing to honor the translation mistakes after so many years. Isn't that wonderful?

Fr I wouldn't be suprised if it had something to do with being recognised as OG player.

 

[pxl_pushr]

Have people ever questioned Squal x Rinoa? As Rinoa was into Seifer before. Because I always had the impression that it's just CT that gets over overanalysed.



It gives me "I'm not like the average FFVII fan" vibes. They love the OG so much that they are even willing to honor the translation mistakes after so many years. Isn't that wonderful?

Fr I wouldn't be suprised if it had something to do with being recognised as OG player.

The most I’ve seen people say about SquallxRinoa is that it’s a young love with less to justify it ( though I think being willing to leap into the vacuum of space to save her says more than it gets credit for )… which is bizarre because Cloud and Aerith is even faster if I’m remembering the timeline of FF8 correctly?

 

[abzy1200]

What‘s funnier about the Aeris situation is that it’s not even her default name in the game files in the OG.

In speed runs where they skip the part when you name her, the game just sets it as “Aerith”.

cool oddity.

 

[Ryushikaze]

Now that you mention this, I remember omg this is hysterical that in 2024 they still resort to that!

I'm still amused and boggled at it.

Someone calling her Aeris is always a red flag for me. I always think "well, you're not even willing to accept that her name is not what you thought it was, if you're that anal about not accepting reality why should I trust any thing you say?"

Exactly. It indicates a refusal to listen. The fact that the FF fanwiki still uses Aeris when referring to the OG and nowhere else is indicative of a lot of these people being around, still.

Even in FF2 there was one comment at the end of the game to hint at Maria's feelings for Firion. And what do you know, they apparently become a couple in a novelisation.


I think it's so funny because Aeris isn't her "real name" either. It's Earisu. At least Dragon Ball fan ficcers insist on writing Kakarot as Kakarotto, lol. Edit: It's not an exact equivalent but it's a bit like insisting on calling Tapeta from BOF2 Jean.

At least Jean is still part of his full very long name. If you want to use a BOF2 example, there's insisting that Katt and Bleu are their names, not Rinpu and Deis.

Tell me you don't accept FF7 Compilation without telling me you don't accept FF7 Compilation.

UItimate red flag.

Legit "I prefer to use bad translated material"

This person isn't rejecting the compilation, but they are definitely refusing to consider alternate viewpoints. They keep repeating "The devs made everything up to interpretation" while being very not-subtle about thinking it's not that way at all.

Are these the same people who also unironically claim to be OG purists? Rejecting CC’s expanded characterization of Aerith and Zack , for example? Because my brain always freezes at that absurd combo of positions.

I don't know about that in this case, but it definitely feels like this person is sourcing their arguments from Clerith.com or it's modern equivalent.

What‘s funnier about the Aeris situation is that it’s not even her default name in the game files in the OG.

In speed runs where they skip the part when you name her, the game just sets it as “Aerith”.

cool oddity.

Yeah, the default name value being different from the name screen value is interesting. As is her name being Aerith in the demo. Making her "Aeris" was an almost last minute decision.

 

[Ryeleigh]

Have people ever questioned Squal x Rinoa? As Rinoa was into Seifer before. Because I always had the impression that it's just CT that gets over overanalysed.

I don't actually know what the general stance towards Squall and Rinoa is, lol. I am vaguely aware that Snow/Serah is hated and apparently Serah had "more chemistry" with that guy from the second game, I guess?

As an aside, I think part of the reason for "OG purism" is the hyperfixation on the OG and the OG having enough room for interpretation to allow for projection too. In my experience, people tend to hyperfixate on things they can read whatever they want into.

At least Jean is still part of his full very long name. If you want to use a BOF2 example, there's insisting that Katt and Bleu are their names, not Rinpu and Deis.

I have been corrected. Wrong example then, lol. But BOF had some funny name changes anyway. Like, Miria/Tyr. Unless the Tyr had a reason I'm not aware of?

But also, what, Katt's original name was Rinpu?

 

[Rin]

Are these the same people who also unironically claim to be OG purists? Rejecting CC’s expanded characterization of Aerith and Zack , for example? Because my brain always freezes at that absurd combo of positions.

Yes. Yes they are lol

 

[Yoru]

I don't actually know what the general stance towards Squall and Rinoa is, lol. I am vaguely aware that Snow/Serah is hated and apparently Serah had "more chemistry" with that guy from the second game, I guess?

Funny you talk about Serah because one of the Clerith's argument is that Cloud is in love with Aerith because he takes her head in his arms when she dies at the end of Rebirth.

And Noel (the dude from FFXIII-2) does exactly the same thing with Serah when they were never a thing to begin with. She's married with Snow and never shows any sign of this love for him changing.

 

[Ryeleigh]

Funny you talk about Serah because one of the Clerith's argument is that Cloud is in love with Aerith because he takes her head in his arms when she dies at the end of Rebirth.

Yeah, I honestly don't get this particular argument because I just keep coming back to the question of what's an acceptable level of grief for someone you love but aren't in love with?

And Noel (the dude from FFXIII-2) does exactly the same thing with Serah when they were never a thing to begin with. She's married with Snow and never shows any sign of this love for him changing.

Wasn't the framing also similar to -- wait, what was his name again -- Sonon and his sister?

 

[Rin]

Yeah, I honestly don't get this particular argument because I just keep coming back to the question of what's an acceptable level of grief for someone you love but aren't in love with?


Wasn't the framing also similar to -- wait, what was his name again -- Sonon and his sister?

Cloud and Aerith framing is 1:1 to Sonon and Melphie
I was like "... Hm. This looks familiar. Why is that?" and then I went to watch the Sonon scene again and yeah lol

Spoiler

 

[ViolaaFox]

Funny you talk about Serah because one of the Clerith's argument is that Cloud is in love with Aerith because he takes her head in his arms when she dies at the end of Rebirth.

And Noel (the dude from FFXIII-2) does exactly the same thing with Serah when they were never a thing to begin with. She's married with Snow and never shows any sign of this love for him changing.

Omgg, I remember someone on Twitter doing an comparison of the Aerith/Cloud and Serah/Noel scene and why it's not romantic at all. And I fully agree.

It seems that according to some people, Cloud shouldn't have shown any interaction with Aerith to avoid romanticising the scene. Imagine a scene where she dies and Cloud just walks away....
It just wouldn't work.

 

[Sacky]

I'm still remembering when they were trying to tell me Zack was a Playboy because OG suggested this. While Crisis Core attempted to retcon it. They stopped responding once I said there wasn't enough known about Zack in OG to care about this change.

 

[ViolaaFox]

I'm still remembering when they were trying to tell me Zack was a Playboy because OG suggested this. While Crisis Core attempted to retcon it. They stopped responding once I said there wasn't enough known about Zack in OG to care about this change.

Is this about the scene in OG were Zack is saying something about having several girlfriends?

 

[Sacky]

Is this about the scene in OG were Zack is saying something about having several girlfriends?

Something about the truck scene and his goal not being to get back to Aerith just to use her house

 

[pxl_pushr]

Omgg, I remember someone on Twitter doing an comparison of the Aerith/Cloud and Serah/Noel scene and why it's not romantic at all. And I fully agree.

It seems that according to some people, Cloud shouldn't have shown any interaction with Aerith to avoid romanticising the scene. Imagine a scene where she dies and Cloud just walks away....
It just wouldn't work.

It’s frustrating because that’s one of the reasons I actually like Cloud as a character. He cares a lot, and that’s why he feels to need to cover it in his psychosis.

I completely missed this comparison so good on everyone who spotted it!

 

[looneymoon]

OG purism doesn't really... excuse the more ardent shipping insanity. The natural conclusion to these characters has always been "Cloud and Tifa end up together in a post game world" or "everyone is dead anyway." Those are the only material realities that are plausible and make sense for these characters.

If it's the latter, then no one is having a relationship with anyone. They're all intermingling in some weird polycule of mishmashed personhood. Seriously though, what does romantic preference even matter at that point? Everyone is just lifestream goo. The universe does a lot of reflection on death, but it's still pretty frank about what it is. We and the characters are meant to understand that there is finality to death, because life is a precious thing that needs to be cherished.

Anything to suggest C/A only really has merit in like an AU sense. Which I mean like... I guess the OG kinda leads the audience to consider? But I think the game is looking at much bigger things when it does. It's asking the audience if we can collectively imagine a better world. Perhaps in that world, loss can have meaning beyond the empty feeling of grief. Maybe that world feels a lot less doomed than the one you're living in, and maybe that means you can better come to terms with things like death and grief.

Even if you argue that's inclusive of some romantic look on C/A (to which I'd probably shrug and say, yeah sure, if you want), it's not exactly the biggest takeaway. I don't think the story is posing these kinds of questions to make people wonder about how bad Cloud wants to smash his maybe-would-be-at-one-time girlfriend. I really don't think that this aspect of the story is for the expressed purpose of building some grand romantic narrative between Cloud and Aerith where their love transcends time and space. The story simply is not really about that. The OG is intentionally open ended for a reason, and I reject that those reasons have anything to do with who ends up with who.

 

[Maidenofwar]

The thing with FFXIII was

Spoiler

Noel got his Yeul and Caius got his Yeul and the Yeuls that wanted to stay with Caius did, and everybody got some sort of ending

 

[Sacky]

https://www.reddit.com/r/ff7/s/2uWpFtrjOP

What does this person mean here Aerith picked Denzel I remember Cloud thinking Aerith led him to them. The way they say this though speaks as if she specifically chose Denzel to be Their son? And Dirge mentioned them in the ultimania Tifa still living together after confirming feelings no?

 

[pxl_pushr]

https://www.reddit.com/r/ff7/s/2uWpFtrjOP

What does this person mean here Aerith picked Denzel I remember Cloud thinking Aerith led him to them. The way they say this though speaks as if she specifically chose Denzel to be Their son? And Dirge mentioned them in the ultimania Tifa still living together after confirming feelings no?

Doesn’t Cloud ( and Tifa btw ) think Aerith had a hand in him finding Denzel because he finds the kid at the church?

I mean, he’s not some miraculous conception, he has biological parents ( who resemble two people btw ) so reading too deep into that is both weird and doesn’t paint Aerith in the best light ( aka she’d be crazy )

 

[abzy1200]

Wouldn't it also be mentioned or brought up in CoLW if she really did send Denzel to Cloud?

Thinking somebody or something was sent to you and that it's 'meant to be' simply because of the timing is very normal. My own family had an experience like this with a stray dog who came up to our door one day, so it does happen.

For Cloud (and Tifa) this would be doubly true, since he was having a hard time accepting the past at the time.

 

[pxl_pushr]

Wouldn't it also be mentioned or brought up in CoLW if she really did send Denzel to Cloud?

Thinking somebody or something was sent to you and that it's 'meant to be' simply because of the timing is very normal. My own family had an experience like this with a stray dog who came up to our door one day, so it does happen.

For Cloud (and Tifa) this would be doubly true, since he was having a hard time accepting the past at the time.

Both of them are struggling with guilt, Cloud for Zack and Aerith, Tifa for Platefall ( the incident that killed Denzel’s parents ).

Them looking at raising him as a chance to somehow make up for their failings doesn’t sound out of step.

 

[Yoru]

It's just something symbolic... and obviously some people completely change the context to push their "unhealthy" ideas.

It's a simple human reflex. To see signs sometimes. Finding this sick child without a family or a home seems to Cloud like a sign of destiny. That Aerith, as the new planet's great mother, made this meeting possible. Cloud himself says it's a figure of speech when Tifa corrects him. Because he thinks she's going to tell him it's not. When in fact she reiterates saying "no, she didn't guide him to you, she guided him to us, to our family".

Because that's what they must be now for this young boy who has lost everything "because of them". A new, loving family.

 

[Ryushikaze]

I don't actually know what the general stance towards Squall and Rinoa is, lol. I am vaguely aware that Snow/Serah is hated and apparently Serah had "more chemistry" with that guy from the second game, I guess?

As an aside, I think part of the reason for "OG purism" is the hyperfixation on the OG and the OG having enough room for interpretation to allow for projection too. In my experience, people tend to hyperfixate on things they can read whatever they want into.


I have been corrected. Wrong example then, lol. But BOF had some funny name changes anyway. Like, Miria/Tyr. Unless the Tyr had a reason I'm not aware of?

I can only assume space saving? There's not much reason for it otherwise, since it's Myria in every other game.

But also, what, Katt's original name was Rinpu?

Yep. Rinpu or Linpu Chuan.
Now BOF 2 is a game where it's actually ambiguous which heroine, if any, the hero chooses.

(Also Rand's name is probably meant to be Land, as his last name is Marks)

https://www.reddit.com/r/ff7/s/2uWpFtrjOP

What does this person mean here Aerith picked Denzel I remember Cloud thinking Aerith led him to them. The way they say this though speaks as if she specifically chose Denzel to be Their son? And Dirge mentioned them in the ultimania Tifa still living together after confirming feelings no?

Among several other sources yes, the two of them still live together. Man, referencing the Dirge manual that also calls cloud an Ex-SOLDIER like it's the gospel truth. We have gone back in time.

Doesn’t Cloud ( and Tifa btw ) think Aerith had a hand in him finding Denzel because he finds the kid at the church?

I mean, he’s not some miraculous conception, he has biological parents ( who resemble two people btw ) so reading too deep into that is both weird and doesn’t paint Aerith in the best light ( aka she’d be crazy )

The basic idea is that both of them see raising Denzel and taking care of him as a way to move on from their deeds and failures, and that Aerith brought him to both of them, yes.

 

[Ryeleigh]

I can only assume space saving? There's not much reason for it otherwise, since it's Myria in every other game.

Oh, that probably explains Zog too.

Now BOF 2 is a game where it's actually ambiguous which heroine, if any, the hero chooses.

I'm not sure if it was a deliberate detail but I always liked how it was implied that BOF1 Nina and Ryu married, and you can see this reflected in the subsequent Ninas and Ryus. She switches from healing magic to elemental offensive magic, and her wings get smaller in each game. And Ryu's the one who has healing magic in BOF2 and BOF3.

(Also Rand's name is probably meant to be Land, as his last name is Marks)

Haha, that sounds cute.

 

[Ryushikaze]

Oh, that probably explains Zog too.

He was Zorgon, originally so yeah, probably.

I'm not sure if it was a deliberate detail but I always liked how it was implied that BOF1 Nina and Ryu married, and you can see this reflected in the subsequent Ninas and Ryus. She switches from healing magic to elemental offensive magic, and her wings get smaller in each game. And Ryu's the one who has healing magic in BOF2 and BOF3.

In a similar note, it's a bit implied that Rei of BOF3 might have a bit of dragon blood in him, given he is the only Worent we know of with a secondary form.

Haha, that sounds cute.

BOF2 is full to the brim with pun names. Aspara Gus, natch. Nimufu Mani.

Out of curiosity, where do you fall on the BOF IV as alternate world verse BOF IV earliest in the timeline divide?