So, what do you think the LTD conclusion is? (Round 2)

[Winter]

I know. Fandom is serious business, Zelda. You snooze YOU FUCKING LOSE.

So let's talk about how Aerith/Zack afterdeathsex is the stupidest thing this fandom has ever shit out.

 

[Zee]

Only if you thank me okay.

Now....

I think that two dead people carrying on a relationship is the dumbest thing in the history of existence. Your rebuttal or approval, please.

 

[Winter]

I think that two dead people carrying on a relationship is the dumbest thing in the history of existence. Your rebuttal or approval, please.

Ahaha I approve so much of this. I mean really, everyone lol'd at the concept of Zack being lifestream goo but THE TRUTH HURTS. Aerith stays whole and he becomes... a part of the lifestream.

So unless Aerith has some fucked up sexual relationship with the planet's energy, Z/A afterdeathsex is bullshit.

 

[Kikyou]

Here's a question: why were you guys debating about the colors and sizes a rock is? Y'know, cause magical shiny rocks are still rocks.

I still have a hard time believing that anyone believes that is possible. Fanfiction canon...

Hey man, outdoors sex, whether it is pointy rocks or flower fields, is wild. And wild sex is hottest. K? K.

oh god... you so did not do that... you so didn't... now I have to hate you...

LOL I'M NOT SURE WHAT I DID WRONG (Go ahead and inform me.) BUT YES I DID USE THE WORD NAKAMA. /avidshounenmangareader

Well, that's different then. That's a good reason not to play a game, but I still don't think you should try and debate the content within the game, without actually playing it.

Ah, sorry. I guess I maybe needed a spoiler tag for that? X_x But very good answer, and I agree with you. However, though Aerith has changed, I still believe that Zack is the man she loves. That has been shown clearly in the compilation, imo.

Now, that's different. No-one knew that Aerith's ribbon was a gift from Zack, or that she promised to wear pink for him. Aerith on the other hand, wore Zack's gift even after he died, and continue to wear pink for the next time they meet. The bonds in these two situations are very different. I don't see how after all Aerith and Zack went through, that it could be considered a friendship. The same goes for Cloud and Tifa. They've formed such strong bonds that have never been proven to fade, and yet people insist Cloud and Aerith are so weak that they would throw away their past loves after a mere week of knowing one another? And technically, Aerith never knew who Cloud really was in the first place, and Cloud never opened his heart to her the way he did to Tifa. I don't see how that equals out to love.

I agree, if you're planning to make a well constructed argument for ANYTHING, you need to go through at least most of the materials. And if you're going to make a point of arguing without going through the material, don't admit it during a debate if you're still expecting the other side to take you seriously. :/

lol, that kind of spoiler isn't as bad as AERITH GETS KILLED BY SEPHIROTH!!!11 I can see why you think the compilations show that Aerith still loves Zack, and I really can't argue, or put up a decent argument (not that it was ever my forte in the first place), that since I'm someone who thinks Cloud still loves Aerith even after two-three years. So I can see why you hold the view that, that first love is still special and valid, even now after a long period of time.

Ah, sorry. My aim wasn't to debunk ZxA. It was just a response to your question on how I felt about those quotes on the whole color pink, ribbon, and Zack thing. I wasn't using those examples to say that Aerith still wears her FF7 outfit BECAUSE it was out of friendship. Not at all.

What I mean to say with the AVALANCHE statement, or the Cloud-Zack thing, was that these bonds are not just similar because they are a result of a character chance. They are also similar in that the "physical" material, the ribbons, the sword, Aerith's choice of color, are all proof that those bonds had, or still, exist and are still part of the characters. For Aerith, pink and the ribbon remind her of Zack, and for AVALANCHE they are reminders of Aerith. And are proof that those bonds are all strong and still persisting. Though there are many different views on the exact nature on those bonds.

Which is why I can see why people say Zack and Aerith are inseparable, or why I insist Aerith is still apart of AVALANCHE even after death, or why I can see how people may say Cloud and Tifa loved each other since childhood, or why some people may say Cloud still loves Aerith in the compilation. Sorry I didn't articulate it well enough. ^^;

It's not so much as a rehash, as an actual point of continuity. Crisis Core *does* take place during one of the iconic moments of FFVII's past. Specifically, the Nibelheim Massacre. It'd make no sense not to include since the game is Zack's story, and that was a turning point in his life.

Thing is though, is that Aerith hated the color pink. She wears it because Zack liked it on her and she promised to wear it for him when they met again. It's definitely Zack inspired because she...hated the color pink. And the ribbon was given to her by Zack.

Eh, not really. Aerith didn't date everyone in AVALANCHE for several years and fall in love with them.

And Cloud and Aerith didn't date either.

Well clearly Cloud loves Aerith as a special person to his heart and a close friend, but we're talking about romance here. The romantic love he has, has been clearly shown as going to Tifa. Platonic would be more akin to Cloud and Aerith if anything.

What I meant was that there was a rehash of scenes: I saw some Cloud-fans bitching about how Cloud's limit break coming from Zack first, as "unoriginal" and the Angeal thing was redundant. Most said that SE should come up with new shit so that it is clear Cloud and Zack are different people. But idk, it could be looked as a good supplement for a FF7 remake?

I think it's sad she didn't like pink, and I'm glad Zack suggested it. She does look cute in pink. XD; Does SE give an explanation why? And if they do, don't tell me... I've been spoiled enough as is. Haha.

Again, I didn't mean for my reply to be seen as an attempt to debunk ZxA.

As for Cloud and Aerith dating, they did my first time through the game and then I replayed and tried to get the rest of the different date scenes. Yes, I tried to get Cloud to date Tifa at some point. Just 'cause I'm a cutscene whore.

I'm glad we can all agree that Aerith was special to Cloud in some way, shape, or form. Platonic or romantic, or w/e.

I know you said that you haven't looked at a lot of the extra stuff, but I must ask the question we ask all Clerii, "Where in what you have seen of the compilation does Cloud show romantic interest in Aerith?"

The second part is half true. Cloud has always loved Tifa and there was no 'moving onto' her. They reveal their feelings for one another at the end of the game and start a relationship together. They are together in the compilation. That is trufax stated by canon. And of course he keeps memories of Aerith with him, just like he does of Zack.

Sorry my view varies from yours. But since you asked, I'll just give you some brief points, personal mind you. Just please don't hit me with a baseball bat.

1. I'm a Clerith, so I was probably watching AC with a biased eye... and I enjoyed it a lot. Haha. ^^;
2. Cloud's expressions during the scenes he shared with Aerith meant a lot to me as a viewer.
3. He still visits the church where they first met.
Now, whether that is a product of guilt, love, a combination of both, or w/e you could spend years contesting. But I felt, and took those moments to heart.

To each his or her own about the FF7 game. I'm glad we can at least agree that he keeps memories of both Aerith and Zack.

 

[Zee]

So unless Aerith has some fucked up sexual relationship with the planet's energy, Z/A afterdeathsex is bullshit.

But if she's "with" Zack, Cloud is freeeeeeeee! Even though she's dead anyway lol

Anyway bedtime, early school tomorrow. Keep rockin' it ladies.

 

[Winter]

1. I'm a Clerith, so I was probably watching AC with a biased eye... and I enjoyed it a lot. Haha. ^^;

Exaaactly. Square does this for a reason.

But if she's "with" Zack, Cloud is freeeeeeeee! Even though she's dead anyway lol

Zelda look, Cloud never loved Aerith. BUT SHE NEVER LOVED HIM EITHER NEVER EVER BUT I'M NOT THREATENED

 

[Dashell]

SEE? I Told you Winter would come back
... now if she'd just show those sources

Hey, at least I'm expressing my honest opinion, and not just what will get me thanked my cock rubbed the fastest

Right but the simple point is... materia is materia... it's not related to Aerith.

 

[Vendel]

I still have a hard time believing that anyone believes that is possible. Fanfiction canon...

It's fascinating what people will invent to try and support a ship.

Whereas Cloud and Tifa's relationship requires no fanciful theories. No lengthy essays. No cherry picking.

It's almost as if it was intended that way. /sarcasm

 

[Tennyo]

Zee do you seriously think that all we do in this thread is agree with each other in order to get thanks? You and Lady Vine kind of offend me with that mentality.

Also who in here seriously said that Aerith and Zack are having sex in the Lifestream? I don't think the Lifestream quite works like that. Ghosts can't have sex with anyone, especially the living when the story wraps up their character progression in a way that has them moving on with people that are still alive.

 

[Alessa Gillespie]

I think the dead can have sex in the minds of the mentally disturbed because it happened in my RP post. Terra/Eve are love. Disagree with me and I punch you in the ovaries. ()

 

[Ryushikaze]

Only if you thank me okay.

Now....

I think that two dead people carrying on a relationship is the dumbest thing in the history of existence. Your rebuttal or approval, please.

I think a living person carrying on with a dead person is dumber.
At least both dead people are dead and spectral, so there's no gostfucking.

Zee do you seriously think that all we do in this thread is agree with each other in order to get thanks? You and Lady Vine kind of offend me with that mentality.

It strikes me as a form of projection. Have any of us ever even asked or cared about the thanks? Odd that they'd bring it up, no?

Also who in here seriously said that Aerith and Zack are having sex in the Lifestream? I don't think the Lifestream quite works like that. Ghosts can't have sex with anyone, especially the living when the story wraps up their character progression in a way that has them moving on with people that are still alive.

Yeah, I don't think the folks talking about Zack and Aerith being 'together' post mortum imply anything sexual going on.

 

[Vendel]

Yeah, I don't think the folks talking about Zack and Aerith being 'together' post mortum imply anything sexual going on.

Funny enough all those fanfics about 'soul fusion' and such are 1000% more likely with two goo divers than Cloud and Aerith.

 

[Kikyou]

Here's a proposal: Geostigma is an STD as a result of Jenova and the Lifestream having sex.

 

[Alessa Gillespie]

SEPHIROTH STOP RAPING ZACK.

 

[Dashell]

Here's a proposal: Geostigma is an STD as a result of Jenova and the Lifestream having sex.

What does that have to do with the LT?

EDIT:
you people are nuts.

 

[OneWingedDemon]

Fuck you, Vendel, stealin mah thuder. I was just about to type that

...so what did I miss? I'm tempted to go back, but then I feel like I'm talking to people who are convinced everything including the air is a reference to Aeris (oh look air, air kinda sounds like Aeris). Even if it means that Cloud's actions/scenes have to be judged by standards not applied to anyone else.

Which is, btw Zee, why people are, as you say, "nitpicking".

Materia is materia and the representative source of magic in all of FFVII. Aeris isn't tied to everything.

But then again, people saw Aeris in a fucking lens flare. I guess by comparison, this isn't stretching it much.

 

[I Am Not Me]

What does that have to do with the LT?

EDIT:
you people are nuts.

IT HAS EVERYTHING TO DO WITH THE LT DO U NOT KNOW COMPILATION HERE LIKE WE DO?

WE'RE PERFECTLY NORMAL PEOPLE HERE, QUEXI. UR NUTS AND U PROBABALY TASTE GUD

SEPHIROTH STOP RAPING ZACK.

This is why Cloud hates Sephiroth. Not only did he burn down his hometown and hurt that random neighbor girl in the sexy cowgirl outfit, but he also rapes Zack in the Lifestream. This explains Cloud's behavior towards Sephiroth. Logical and true!

Point for Clack!

Zee do you seriously think that all we do in this thread is agree with each other in order to get thanks? You and Lady Vine kind of offend me with that mentality.

Isn't that what we do? I get thanks for my posts because we all agree that Clack is canon. Or maybe because I'm just cute.

I totally don't thank posts that make sense or that are lulzy or that make valid points or that talk about Zack positively and Clack/Clephiroth/AerTi in general or are generally pretty funny and snarky. I only thank posts because they agree with me, even though I really think a bit differently on the matter.

I'd thank posts that say "I agree" without any basis of why their opinion is the same as mine (unless it's Clack/AerTi, which is pretty self-explanatory). It totally contributes to the discussion, really, so there's no way I wouldn't thank them. I'd also thank posts that don't coincide with what I know, because it totally makes sense to do just that.

I mean, seriously people, why thank posts that make sense? Why thank posts that agree with your PoV and save yourself from quoting it and typing "I agree because I think so too" when you can do just that and look like a spammer, not to mention clutter up precious forum space? That's not why the Thanks function was added, you know.

Maybe I'm being sarcastic?

 

[Kikyou]

I'M THANKING YOU JUST TO BE ARBITRARY.

 

[Celes Chere]

I agree, if you're planning to make a well constructed argument for ANYTHING, you need to go through at least most of the materials. And if you're going to make a point of arguing without going through the material, don't admit it during a debate if you're still expecting the other side to take you seriously. :/

Yeah, I really hate while during the middle of a debate the person says, "Well I haven't played the game". I just and can't believe I wasted my time on them. And then I say "Well, that makes a lot of sense. No wonder your logic makes no sense".

So I can see why you hold the view that, that first love is still special and valid, even now after a long period of time.

Interesting. Thanks. =D

Which is why I can see why people say Zack and Aerith are inseparable, or why I insist Aerith is still apart of AVALANCHE even after death, or why I can see how people may say Cloud and Tifa loved each other since childhood, or why some people may say Cloud still loves Aerith in the compilation. Sorry I didn't articulate it well enough. ^^;

No, that's fine. Thanks for the explanations, and making your opinion clear. Looks like you're very accepting of everything, lol. But since you are a Clerith can I ask the golden question? Which is most definitely, why do you think Cloud loves Aerith?

... now if she'd just show those sources

Like I said, never going to happen.

I'M THANKING YOU JUST TO BE ARBITRARY.

How about me?

 

[Vendel]

Fuck you, Vendel, stealin mah thuder. I was just about to type that

I do it because I'm evil.

 

[Dashell]

Vendel's in ur topics, stealin ur thunder.

 

[Makoeyes987]

What I meant was that there was a rehash of scenes: I saw some Cloud-fans bitching about how Cloud's limit break coming from Zack first, as "unoriginal" and the Angeal thing was redundant. Most said that SE should come up with new shit so that it is clear Cloud and Zack are different people. But idk, it could be looked as a good supplement for a FF7 remake?

Those fans are ridiculous. Only one limit break belonging to Zack resembles one from Cloud. That's Meteor Shots. The rest are all unique. I'll let you decide for yourself regarding the characters, but they all serve a purpose to the plot. Cloud and Zack are clearly differentiated.

As for Cloud and Aerith dating, they did my first time through the game and then I replayed and tried to get the rest of the different date scenes. Yes, I tried to get Cloud to date Tifa at some point. Just 'cause I'm a cutscene whore.

I'm glad we can all agree that Aerith was special to Cloud in some way, shape, or form. Platonic or romantic, or w/e.

What I mean by "dated" is...gone steady and go through a prolonged, meaningful relationship. Like she did with Zack. Zack and Aerith dated for a good year. Cloud and Aerith knew each other for at most, 2 weeks. And they were more fighting to save the world than anything else. Their date at the Gold Saucer wasn't exactly romantic.

And no one's trying to say Aerith wasn't special or important to Cloud. Not at all. But we're talking about romance here, and I'd like to know where exactly Cloud and Aerith ever truly shared a romantic moment.

Sorry my view varies from yours. But since you asked, I'll just give you some brief points, personal mind you. Just please don't hit me with a baseball bat.

1. I'm a Clerith, so I was probably watching AC with a biased eye... and I enjoyed it a lot. Haha. ^^;
2. Cloud's expressions during the scenes he shared with Aerith meant a lot to me as a viewer.
3. He still visits the church where they first met.
Now, whether that is a product of guilt, love, a combination of both, or w/e you could spend years contesting. But I felt, and took those moments to heart.

To each his or her own about the FF7 game. I'm glad we can at least agree that he keeps memories of both Aerith and Zack.

Goodie. We need more Clerith's to intellectually spar with.

And well, we don't need years to contest it. The creator's state clearly it was a product of guilt right here, here, and then in the subsequent Reunion Files of the movie. He went to the Church because he felt guilty and depressed over Aerith's death.

So how can you say it had anything to do with romantic love, when the creator's have stated the opposite? Especially when Cloud also said he wanted to move on and start a new life with Tifa in the Case of Tifa novella?

 

[KissTheRain]

Those fans are ridiculous. Only one limit break belonging to Zack resembles one from Cloud. That's Meteor Shots. The rest are all unique. I'll let you decide for yourself regarding the characters, but they all serve a purpose to the plot. Cloud and Zack are clearly differentiated.

What is pissing me off is people who say Cloud is a rip off of Zack even though he was there first. Like that for example, it was Cloud's limit break not Zack's just SE thinks making a Cloud a copy cat is lovely for his character. Yes, yes I know there are many, many differences but like Z/A's and C/A's meeting didn't have to be repeated, but yet they still did. Same for Zack's and Angeal's death, can we say originality Square. <_<

Cloud and Aerith knew each other for at most, 2 weeks.

I think it was more like a month or possibly two, but I'll analyze it better then edit/get back to.

So how can you say it had anything to do with romantic love, when the creator's have stated the opposite?

To a Cloti, Cloud starting a family with Tifa is romantic and like a husband/wife. Him visiting the church is guilt

To a Clerith, Cloud starting a family with Tifa is friendship/platonic like friends/siblings. Cloud visiting the church is love.

It's as simple as that Mako, you can see/interpret what your eye sees and can't really help it. I personally think both can be seen as romantic, but don't need to be just in either situation if it is romantic it makes the scene much more poignant and enjoyable.

 

[Tennyo]

I think the dead can have sex in the minds of the mentally disturbed because it happened in my RP post. Terra/Eve are love. Disagree with me and I punch you in the ovaries. ()

Yes, but you're a special case.

 

[Ryushikaze]

What is pissing me off is people who say Cloud is a rip off of Zack even though he was there first. Like that for example, it was Cloud's limit break not Zack's just SE thinks making a Cloud a copy cat is lovely for his character. Yes, yes I know there are many, many differences but like Z/A's and C/A's meeting didn't have to be repeated, but yet they still did. Same for Zack's and Angeal's death, can we say originality Square. <_<

Cloud being a copycat of Zack IS his character, or at least part of it, in the beginning. The whole 'lying to himself, created my own illusory world' bit? Yeah. It's a deliberate parallel.

I think it was more like a month or possibly two, but I'll analyze it better then edit/get back to.

The entire GAME was less than two months. Disc 1 was about two weeks.

To a Cloti, Cloud starting a family with Tifa is romantic and like a husband/wife. Him visiting the church is guilt

To a Clerith, Cloud starting a family with Tifa is friendship/platonic like friends/siblings. Cloud visiting the church is love.

In general, a man starting a family with a woman is romantic and like a husband and wife. A man visiting a church and wanting forgiveness is guilt.
This isn't just about C/T v C/A. C/T is based on some of the commonest occurrences and assumptions of fictions. C/A doesn't seem to be based on anything other than insisting it is so.

It's as simple as that Mako, you can see/interpret what your eye sees and can't really help it. I personally think both can be seen as romantic, but don't need to be just in either situation if it is romantic it makes the scene much more poignant and enjoyable.

Buh? Explain.