So, what do you think the LTD conclusion is? (Round 2)

[KissTheRain]

*Points to myself*

Hehe, I was only kidding a little. I just meant that Cloud and Tifa's fanbases are much, much higher than Barrets, not saying I don't like him just my fetishes are with the emos. XD

@Isabella-Hrm, your posts are always so smart. XD I haven't read the DoC manuel in a while so you know I just shoved one part in. But yes, I believe it says crap about Cloud's journey and such and such. But the part of Aerith's status changing, well if Tifa was promoted to girlfriend then hasn't hers too?

it doesn't mean in any way that Aerith is more important or Tifa is less important... it's just saying he'll never forget her

Because she isn't, neither are. They are Cloud's friends just like Zack, Barret, etc. And that's how i'm always gonna see it.after i'm done looking at my Cloti hentai

 

[Frostwave]

A girl with the blood of the Ancients flowing through her veins, who is engraved in Cloud's heart for the rest of his life.

If this quote implies romance on Cloud's part, wouldn't it be voided by the many times Aerith is referred to as being a friend and comrade to Cloud? If 'childhood friends' relegates Tifa to the role of a platonic friend...

 

[paoo]

If this quote implies romance on Cloud's part, wouldn't it be voided by the many times Aerith is referred to as being a friend and comrade to Cloud? If 'childhood friends' relegates Tifa to the role of a platonic friend...

^ This.

And after all the times Tifa have been called;
Important woman to Cloud
The mother of their family
Cloud Someone's lover
Creates the catalyst for Cloud

And what do Aerith got besides "ingraved in Cloud's heart etc."? She's a mother-figure, a comrade.

Did you see the difference, maybe?

And yes, Cloud and Tifa are childhood-friends. That's what they've always been called. That's how we knew those two together in the first place. But that doesn't ruin the thing that they are lovers, we already got proofs for that.

 

[Fighter]

I know, I know that they were childhood friends, but why if she is more important to Cloud than just a childhood friend, why do they only call her that? If she is fucking Cloud then I would like to see an honary title.

So having it in a bunch of Ultimanias and Reunion Files is not enough? You need it in every single generic instruction manual?

@"Explicit cloti moment": I'm sorry but to think that between the Ultimania quotes about sharing their mutual feelings combined with the SE stuff interview about the risqué nature of the HW scene and the scene itself to think that nothing happened there is plain ludicrous. Lets have some common sense. It's more than a lot of FF couples got.

 

[Fairheartstrife]

Anyways, didn't mean to offend you, sorry
We cool?
Thank you

We're cool.

 

[Fairheartstrife]

wait what. Why has no one caught this. It may just be me, but RoLo sounds short for ROgue/LOgan, and Rogue is not Storm.

Geez you guys, why am I the only one who noticed this.

RoLo is Ororo x Logan. Trust me. There are sites dedicated to the pairing, even comic articles and Hudlin addressed them at last year's Comic Con. It's one the largest fanon pairings in Marvel. Now, back to relevant LTD...

 

[Dashell]

We're cool.

I would like to hear from KtR what evidence the Cleriths have that is so compelling that she stays neutral, so that we can debunk it and change that.

 

[Madame Mayor]

Doesn't that instruction manual also say that Cloud and Tifa are running an orphanage?

 

[Alessa Gillespie]

So correct me if I'm wrong, but is the argument now "Barret is too unpopular to be included in the family"? Must be why they made up a ttly new character like Denzel, it was clearly to replace him. Though I do wonder why Squeenix would write the stories of people that are so unpopular like him, Yuffie and Nanaki to explain what they were doing between FFVII and AC. I mean, why not write another Vincent story, he's clearly popular. Or at least not give away Aerith's story to some fanboy and properly write out every excruciating detail of what was done between FFVII and AC, since she's extremely popular.

I mean, why are they wasting any time at all on that lozer Barret at all? How infuriating.

 

[paoo]

He's black.

Oh, sorry...

:bmonster:

 

[Strangelove]

Someone correct me if I'm wrong, but doesn't the DoC manual just regurgitate what was said about them in the FF7 manual? Cloud and Tifa still childhood friends, Cloud still an ex-SOLDIER, etc? It doesn't sound like they rewrote a whole lot for the DOC manual when it came to recapping the characters. They really only needed to rewrite Aerith's, because ... her status changed.

I went and took a picture of that:

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v242/vilaeth_0/dcffvii.jpg

As you can see, it doesn't take an expert in the Japanese to see that this about the story of FFVII.

The bit in the red square says that Cloud is an "former member of Shinra's elite military force 'SOLDIER'." But are we supposed to take that to mean that's all Cloud is? Because DC's manual says it?

Neither Cloud nor Tifa have an actual profile for DC in the manual. This thing is talking about what happened in FFVII, and that's what they were in FFVII.

If this quote implies romance on Cloud's part, wouldn't it be voided by the many times Aerith is referred to as being a friend and comrade to Cloud?

This.

 

[Ryushikaze]

Please compare/contrast. ^^

Give me an example of the evidence that convinces you all the other FF pairings are canon first. I wish to have fully defined goalposts first.

I swear there is a quote saying Tifa calls Marlene her daughter. Of course it is not with Barret, but it is mentioned.

That's in CoT, and in that same novella, she calls Cloud a young father with his children, those children being Denzel and Marlene. So yes, once they become the family of 3, Tifa considers Marlene her daughter and Cloud her daddy.

]Ryu, my question is why are they called "childhood friends" in DoC and other parts of the compilation if they are lovers now?

In DoC because they just recycled the FF7 manual- Cloud is called an Ex-SOLDIER for freak's sake.

Well la dee da, thanks Square for leaving out the character that was going to be one of the 3 main at a time. Seriously, I know why they did it though, Barret isn't that popular and I have never met a fangirl for him, that's why. I count Barret as part of the family, although not as directly as Cloud & Tifa.

Barret was 'popular'- or at least important- enough to get one of the first three OTWTAS Novellas, before anyone else, even characters like Nanaki and Yuffie who have tended to be more popular.
Denzel had 0 popularity, being a brand new character, and was added as part of the family.
It is not popularity that decides who is part of the family, but rather the constraints of the story.

@Wolverine-I don't really have anything to say back, except that was a well written display of the family and I agree. ....and I was a LukexLeia fan. XD

So... you agree that Barret is not part of the family as considered by Cloud and Tifa, or anyone other than Marlene?

]Did they miss Tifa's "fuck me" smile to Cloud. Only if Cloud was a sheer homo, he could not resist that. XD

Hell, even if he was, he might be rethinking his sexuality, even though it's not a choice.

Someone correct me if I'm wrong, but doesn't the DoC manual just regurgitate what was said about them in the FF7 manual? Cloud and Tifa still childhood friends, Cloud still an ex-SOLDIER, etc? It doesn't sound like they rewrote a whole lot for the DOC manual when it came to recapping the characters. They really only needed to rewrite Aerith's, because ... her status changed.

Pretty much, yes. And Aerith's only changes to reflect her now being dead, mentioning neither of the two major acts she did post-mortem.

I know, I know that they were childhood friends, but why if she is more important to Cloud than just a childhood friend, why do they only call her that? If she is fucking Cloud then I would like to see an honary title. And possibly one that is better than:

A girl with the blood of the Ancients flowing through her veins, who is engraved in Cloud's heart for the rest of his life.

1- That just means she won't be forgotten
2- That statement was said 'first' about Cloud's promise to Tifa, using the same characters and everything. So if it's romantic for Cloud to never forget Aerith, it's also romantic to never forget the promise.
3- An important woman to him and also a part of the family. The mother of the family they were forming in edge, among her roles in the world is that of someone's beloved, They revealed their mutual feelings to each other. Their dialogue underneath the highwind was Risque, and implied risque acts come the fadeout, Cloud believes his live can succeed where all other times it has failed because he has Tifa with him this time, in a different way than before.

As Hito has told us several times, this is a Japanese euphemism for "won't forget her," which is why it was translated that way in the English version. It doesn't have quite the dramatic implications in Japanese that the Clerith want to give it. Of course, that's assuming you want to trust that sneaky Hito.

He's totally untrustworthy, ever since he turned traitor and stopped translating the proper pinkness!

 

[Celes Chere]

who is engraved in Cloud's heart for the rest of his life.

And yet quotes about Cloud starting a new life with Tifa, and Zack+Aerith being inseparable destiny are ignored.

 

[Strangelove]

Inseparable destiny?

Engrish translation?

 

[Celes Chere]

Er, inseparable/destiny I mean.

 

[OneWingedDemon]

I just noticed this:

No, it's not obvious otherwise we wouldn't have dozens of fantardlings arguing

And the Church only officially admitted the whole Earth-no-flat idea around the 90s. That's doesn't mean it was unclear until a decade ago.

People still argue the Rinoa = Ultimecia point. It doesn't mean the game itself wasn't clear, anymore than it means that Hermione/Harry is valid simply because a few very stupid people believe so.

 

[Raquelborn]

I'll be one of the few here that does agree with you. I don't think there is a canon couple of VII and Cloud is single. And it's 12 years and they get new information, but personally I still don't think there is a result.

I was unsure like you until I saw:

She and Cloud came to realize their feelings for each other in the end of the story, and live together in AC and DC.

She ventured into Lifestream together with Cloud. Amidst the course of him trying to ascertain his memories, they became aware of the thoughts/feelings which each other was holding.

And, just to hammer this home, Tifa is in love with Cloud both at 15 and during the original game (and beyond) as I'm sure you can agree, and therefore the mutual feelings they hold for each other must be romantic.

I'm assuming we all believe Cloti to be canon?

I do because of the quotes above. But I'm open minded to any backtracking the creators wish to make and I'm still watching out for a kissing scene/anything unavoidably romantic like that to occur between them to make my conclusion more concrete.

Makes me think of all the pissed LukexLeia fans there must have been...

Exactly. A small drift of annoyance swept through me when I read that.


Also, I swear I read a quote somewhere that stated a conclusion to the LTD had been discussed and made by SE's staff. Anyone?

 

[Dashell]

She ventured into Lifestream together with Cloud. Amidst the course of him trying to ascertain his memories, they became aware of the thoughts/feelings which each other was holding.

Fuck dude I used to argue that the Lifestream event wasn't romantic. People would tell me it was all about Tifa... I would say that the reason Aerith wasn't there was because Cloud was trying to figure out what happened at a part in his life when Aerith wasn't there... so THAT'S why she wasn't there...

Way to make me rethink that.

The really funny thing is I was JUST coming in here to discuss that to get the topic going XD

Also, I swear I read a quote somewhere that stated a conclusion to the LTD had been discussed and made by SE's staff. Anyone?

Hint

Spoiler

Spoiler

Spoiler

It's Tifa

 

[Eerie]

Really, you didn't see the Lifestream event as romantic? It made me MELT and ship CloTi, as far as I'm concerned

It was pretty obvious that we were meant to see that Cloud hadn't change since that time and the girl that made him that way was pretty much Tifa [the promise, the why he went to join Soldier, the secret he kept in his heart, the why he hid when he came back, etc and since he became a veggie for 4 years right after that, that's basically right before FF7 for him].

I mean, only Tifa could help him, he was calling out for her... how was that not romantic? It was the depth of his heart we're talking about here The true Cloud as we discovered him, no matter what the player prefered in Disc One, is very Tifa-centric.

 

[Splintered]

Fuck dude I used to argue that the Lifestream event wasn't romantic. People would tell me it was all about Tifa... I would say that the reason Aerith wasn't there was because Cloud was trying to figure out what happened at a part in his life when Aerith wasn't there... so THAT'S why she wasn't there...

Way to make me rethink that.

The lifestream part was one of my favorite Cloti moments, even more than the highwind scene.

and Zack+Aerith being inseparable destiny are ignored.

wat? Where is this? I'm a bit of a horrible fantard for ZA but I've never read anything like that. I kind of gave up hope since Maiden and Case of Lifestream.

 

[Dashell]

Really, you didn't see the Lifestream event as romantic?

I think I might have gone, "awww". But I didn't see it as totally romantic, no. I saw it as Cloud trying to find himself with Tifa's help... hense I went "awww." I guess I thought it was cute than anything ; I can see where it'd be romantic though. It's just... Cloud's mind isn't the ideal setting for a great date IMO

The true Cloud as we discovered him, no matter what the player prefered in Disc One, is very Tifa-centric.

I just don't like the "Aerith wasn't in his thoughts" argument because she wasn't there at that point in his life and that's why she wasn't there
Plus in Maiden didn't it say that she lead Tifa to Cloud?... I'm... not sure what my point is there but ...


uh...


nice shoes

 

[Splintered]

You know, I kind of theorized that Aerith led Tifa to Cloud pre-Maiden. Just because after Aerith's death I always associated the lifestream with her.

 

[Dashell]

You know, I kind of theorized that Aerith led Tifa to Cloud pre-Maiden. Just because after Aerith's death I always associated the lifestream with her.

OMFG RAPID CLERITH! GTFO

And didn't Aerith help them out of the lifestream if I'm not mistaken?

 

[Ryushikaze]

I think I might have gone, "awww". But I didn't see it as totally romantic, no. I saw it as Cloud trying to find himself with Tifa's help... hense I went "awww." I guess I thought it was cute than anything ; I can see where it'd be romantic though. It's just... Cloud's mind isn't the ideal setting for a great date IMO

How do you figure? The scenery is nice, the atmosphere is good, and Tifa always knows what's on his mind.

I just don't like the "Aerith wasn't in his thoughts" argument because she wasn't there at that point in his life and that's why she wasn't there

But it's not that she's not the focus, but rather, that she doesn't even warrant a single mention, or her image appearing anywhere, which is odd if she is supposed to be the ZOMFG Tragic lost love, given that we're literally in the depths of Cloud's subconscious, and seeing the things that are important to him, what makes him HIM.
Instead, we see that in each major section of his past we go over, Tifa features. There's plenty of other things they could have shown to demonstrate Cloud was truly a real person, but instead, they go over three incidents involving Tifa, including a reaffirmation of the promise scene, Cloud revealing he wanted to get her notice, him apologizing for being late during the nibleheim incident, etc.

Plus in Maiden didn't it say that she lead Tifa to Cloud?... I'm... not sure what my point is there but ...

It said she protected Tifa from mako poisoning and guided her to Cloud's closed heart, but it was Cloud who opened that heart to Tifa alone.

You know, I kind of theorized that Aerith led Tifa to Cloud pre-Maiden. Just because after Aerith's death I always associated the lifestream with her.

I'd figured Cloud pulled Tifa in to protect her from Mako Poisoning, since she screams for Cloud as it happens, and it fits that 'come to my rescue' arc they have together.

 

[Fairheartstrife]

OMFG RAPID CLERITH! GTFO
And didn't Aerith help them out of the lifestream if I'm not mistaken?

You are mistaken.