So, what do you think the LTD conclusion is? (Round 2)

[Dashell]

Clerith's love bleeding the two together as if it all just means the same thing when it really doesn't.

Then they should have no problem thinking Aerith isn't all good And their personalities are the same in KH, so I don't see why Aerith not being "wholly good" would only apply to KH.

 

[Makoeyes987]

Their personalities are not the same....

Not to say she's perfect, because she isn't. But she really isn't the same.

 

[A]

I don't know, my friend brought it up a while ago and I'm not sure what the quote is that she was talking about. My point was that Nomura said she wasn't wholly good or pure, so.. that... proves that she's not like some Cleriths like to believe

If you ever happen to find it, post it here too!

There doesn't need to be anything said from Nomura either to know that Aerith isn't perfect as some make her out to be. The game already proves that she isn't the angel that they come to think of her as. And to be honest, it'd be a bore to have such a stiff character. Everyone has a bad side to them, no?

EDIT: Wait, same personality as who now? Aerith and Cloud?

 

[Dashell]

Their personalities are not the same....

Not to say she's perfect, because she isn't. But she really isn't the same.

So we agree, Aerith isn't perfect
Glad we had this talk

 

[Tetsujin]

Calm down, I'm just supporting my opinion.

CLOTI ISN't CANON LOLOLOLOOLOOLOLOOOLLOOLLOLOLOLLOLOLOLOOLOLOLOOLO
wat

Also - There's a novella?

Stop the trolling and gtfo please?

 

[Ryushikaze]

Further, you admit that scripts are literature. Scripts go into making movies and video games.
Ergo, literature goes into making movies and video games with scripts.
FF7 was made with a script.
Ergo, literature went into FF7. An ingredient of FF7 is literature.

 

[The Red Mage]

square doesn't give two shits about the love triangle and prefers to have the fans have a ridiculous 13-year old flame war about it that will never ever reach a conclusion

 

[Ryushikaze]

Sounds alot like the original content of this topic before the literary discussion came up

Consider a revision of your standup material and take the spam elsewhere.

square doesn't give two shits about the love triangle and prefers to have the fans have a ridiculous 13-year old flame war about it that will never ever reach a conclusion

'Killing option B' is not 'never ever reaching a conclusion'

 

[Alex]

square doesn't give two shits about the love triangle and prefers to have the fans have a ridiculous 13-year old flame war about it that will never ever reach a conclusion

Finally, somebody's speaking some sense up in here.

 

[Tetsujin]

You all need to shut the fuck up and get back on topic.

 

[The Red Mage]

Consider a revision of your standup material and take the spam elsewhere.



'Killing option B' is not 'never ever reaching a conclusion'

By "reaching a conclusion" I meant that the fans would stop arguing over it

 

[Ⓐaron]

The entire argument is, imo.

The problem with your second distinction, though, is that that is, for all intents and purposes, nothing more than the Reader's Digest version, at best. Yes, you have the dialogue, but you're missing out on everything else that was written - characterization, imagery...all of these things cannot be transmitted through dialogue alone (and, if you're honest, even seeing something right in front of you isn't even close to being the same as what the words themselves from the work of literature evoke in your mind).

Good thing a properly written script mentions... everything you just mentioned. I'm sure the original script for FFVII specified all of these things before they programmed the cutscenes in, just as nearly every film script ever produced does.

 

[Reith123]

and yet i log back in and another vote for tifa, why am i not suprised? because im not..pple know whats what at least..

 

[Ⓐaron]

By "reaching a conclusion" I meant that the fans would stop arguing over it

Fans still argue about

Spoiler: Harry Potter book 7 spoilers

who Harry's twoo wuv is despite the fact that he's canonically married and fathered children.

Using "fans will stop arguing about it" as a criterion for deciding whether canon has been established is therefore a ridiculous standard.

 

[Ryushikaze]

SPAM SPLIT HERE- http://thelifestream.net/forums/showthread.php?t=2631

GO THERE TO CONTINUE THE LITERATURE DISCUSSION.

 

[Eerie]

By "reaching a conclusion" I meant that the fans would stop arguing over it

As Tyrant said, it's not because some people can't reach that conclusion that it's not there. One of my best friends is a hardcore clerith, yet she admits that the canon way is cloti. She just likes clerith for what it could have been. She also loves Zerith [she's an Aerith lover, if anything]. And even thoug she HATES CloTi, she cries in despair every time she sees the shit some spout.

No matter how much we present facts, people chose to ignore them.
If I say:
-Tifa is someone's lover.
-Tifa's ideal man is Cloud.
-At the beginning of AC/C, Tifa is just like a woman who has been left by a man.
-Tifa wears the pants in the relationship.
-Barret helps Cloud and Tifa to build THEIR home.
-Tifa is an important woman to Cloud and the mother of his family [or something alike]
-Cloud and Tifa realized their feelings during the game
-Cloud had a crush/was in love with Tifa when they were kids
-Cloud wanted to become a Soldier to impress Tifa
-Cloud said under the Highwind that since he was a kid, nothing had changed to Tifa
-Cloud and Tifa shared a risqué scene under the Highwind
-Cloud returned to Tifa and the kids at the end of AC/C
-Cloud finds his own Promise Land at the end of AC/C
-Cloud and Tifa still live together during CoD, years after
-Cloud is like a father, Tifa is like a mother
-Cloud and Tifa belong together

Then, what should be the conclusion? What is so hard to understand? I'm not grasping at straws, I'm just presenting what the whole compilation says, with some babbling from the creators.

It's not the ones who draw logical conclusions that should rethink their thought process; it's just there, everywhere in the compilation, for anyone wishing to see the clues.

 

[Makoeyes987]

I wish people wouldn't come in here and assume we're arguing over nothing without even looking at the fucking argument's context within FFVII and the points contained therein. It's ignorant to assume people are arguing over nothing and no conclusion is reached without actually reading the damn thing. How are people having a discussion and intelligent debate if there's no conclusion or possibility of one? It makes no sense.

 

[A]

We say, they say:

-Tifa is someone's lover.

That doesn't mean it's Cloud.

-At the beginning of AC/C, Tifa is just like a woman who has been left by a man.

Meaning Cloud doesn't want her.

-Tifa wears the pants in the relationship.

How does this make Cloud / Tifa canon?

-Barret helps Cloud and Tifa to build THEIR home.

Cloud and Tifa are best friends. Big deal.

-Tifa is an important woman to Cloud and the mother of his family [or something alike]

Tifa is important, because she's his friend. And of course Tifa is like a mother to Cloud!

-Cloud and Tifa realized their feelings during the game

Their feelings on how they could be nothing more than friends.

-Cloud had a crush/was in love with Tifa when they were kids

Those feelings can die away over time.

-Cloud wanted to become a Soldier to impress Tifa

That's not the only reason.

-Cloud said under the Highwind that since he was a kid, nothing had changed to Tifa

Wait, how does this make Cloud/Tifa canon?

-Cloud and Tifa shared a risqué scene under the Highwind

Yeah, risque because it was rejection.

-Cloud returned to Tifa and the kids at the end of AC/C

But spends time with Aerith when he can.

-Cloud finds his own Promise Land at the end of AC/C

Which is Aerith being there for him.

-Cloud and Tifa still live together during CoD, years after

And yet there is no romantic implication to be seen.

-Cloud is like a father, Tifa is like a mother

It was never stated that Cloud was a father. Only Tifa as a mother.

-Cloud and Tifa belong together

Aerith is in Cloud's heart.

 

[Fairheartstrife]

Now, back on topic, I think it's evident by the number of votes that Tifa is-- by the majority-- seen as Cloud's canon love interest. The few straggling Clerith's that remain die-hards are grasping at straws and it's almost painful to watch them floundering.

 

[Fairheartstrife]

Ali, you are a scary Clerith. O.O

 

[The Red Mage]

I was under the impression that Square left it ambiguous on purpose

Though I haven't watched Advent Children


also why isn't there a yuffie option on the poll i like yuffie

 

[A]

Ali, you are a scary Clerith. O.O

Why thank you.

also why isn't there a yuffie option on the poll i like yuffie

Because this is the Love Triangle.

 

[Makoeyes987]

Not really apt to judge what the LTD conclusion is, or how fans are arguing about it, then are you? Since...you don't quite have all the facts. It's not just teenagers flaming each other.

And why would Yuffie be an option? Cloud's never shown feelings for Yuffie.

 

[Ryushikaze]

We say, they say:


That doesn't mean it's Cloud.


Meaning Cloud doesn't want her.


How does this make Cloud / Tifa canon?


Cloud and Tifa are best friends. Big deal.


Tifa is important, because she's his friend. And of course Tifa is like a mother to Cloud!


Their feelings on how they could be nothing more than friends.


Those feelings can die away over time.


That's not the only reason.


Wait, how does this make Cloud/Tifa canon?


Yeah, risque because it was rejection.


But spends time with Aerith when he can.


Which is Aerith being there for him.


And yet there is no romantic implication to be seen.


It was never stated that Cloud was a father. Only Tifa as a mother.


Aerith is in Cloud's heart.

Come now, A, if you're going to Faux Clerith, make it better. Your responses are too short. It shows you're just ignoring things or making them up. You need to offer absurd and implausible alternate explanations.

 

[Fairheartstrife]

I was under the impression that Square left it ambiguous on purpose

Though I haven't watched Advent Children

Compilation takes away any ambiguity that VII may have had (although I didn't see any, but I understand some people that did). Before Crisis, Crisis Core, the Novellas, AC:Complete and DoC cement the Cloti canon, but when you add in creator interviews and commentary, it becomes blindingly obvious and only those refusing to acknowledge the narrative are left undecided or "other".

I do strongly suggest reading the novellas if nothing else. I know not everyone has access to the movies.