So, what do you think the LTD conclusion is? (Round 2)

Who does Cloud love?

  • Aerith

    Votes: 20 14.2%

  • Tifa

    Votes: 121 85.8%
  • Total voters
    141
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M

Madame Mayor

Banned
I was trying to show WHY SOME PEOPLE AREN'T BLOODY CONVINCED by the "they live together raising children" line, I was not trying to disprove Cloud and Tifa's relationship.
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By 'some people' though, we are talking mainly about crazy shippers who then spread their crazy shipper logic around the internet. They aren't convinced by anything, so why would Cloud and Tifa being in a classic romantic relationship situation change anything?

HP spoilers
Some people aren't convinced by Harry marrying Ginny that he and Hermione weren't meant to be. Do we need to show examples of people getting married who aren't happy together and eventually break up to explain why these people aren't convinced? No, we just accept the fact that their opinions on the matter are skewed by shipping.
 
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Tennyo

Tennyo

Higher Further Faster
^This, except:

No, we just accept the fact that their opinions on the matter is skewed by shipping
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"Opinion is skewed" or "Opinions are skewed." *is being a bitch lately* :muhaha:

Also I love how Vendel fixed his grammar. :awesome:
 
Fairheartstrife

Fairheartstrife

[no fucks given]
AKA
FHS, that cloti bitch
Tennyo said:
^This, except:

"Opinion is skewed" or "Opinions are skewed." *is being a bitch lately* :muhaha:

Also I love how Vendel fixed his grammar. :awesome:
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Also(comma) I love how Vendel fixed his grammar.

**hates random bitchy grammar fixing** :arr:

Only when it serves the greater good--and mocking--do we need to stoop to this. LOL.
 
Fairheartstrife

Fairheartstrife

[no fucks given]
AKA
FHS, that cloti bitch
Raquelborn said:
Also, see my reply to Ryu because I was trying to show WHY SOME PEOPLE AREN'T BLOODY CONVINCED by the "they live together raising children" line, I was not trying to disprove Cloud and Tifa's relationship.
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Some people aren't bloody convinced that gravity exists. Some people are idiots.

Them living together and raising children together is a solid argument. You're saying that two people living together and raising kids doesn't "always" mean a romantic relationship, and while that's true is some cases, such is not the case here (as pointed out a hundred and seventy times already), but I think Vendel answered this best, so I won't go on.
 
Tennyo

Tennyo

Higher Further Faster
Fairheartstrife said:
Also(comma) I love how Vendel fixed his grammar.

**hates random bitchy grammar fixing** :arr:

Only when it serves the greater good--and mocking--do we need to stoop to this. LOL.
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Grammar fixing is always for the greater good. :monster:

Also thanks, I sometimes do forget my punctuation. Even though in that instance I do believe it may have been optional.
 
Fairheartstrife

Fairheartstrife

[no fucks given]
AKA
FHS, that cloti bitch
Tennyo said:
Grammar fixing is always for the greater good. :monster:

Also thanks, I sometimes do forget my punctuation. Even though in that instance I do believe it may have been optional.
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LOL.

And no, in that instance, not optional. :neo:

Anyway, onto the LTD...

Cleriths and some other people think Cloud was gone from Seventh for months (although we clearly know otherwise via timeline and common sense) but while I was watching ACC last night, it occurred to me: Why would Barret be calling him to deliver a message to Marlene if he'd been off-radar for so long? Personally, given the quickness of geostigma as well as reading the novellas, I surmise Cloud's been "missing" for only a couple of weeks--if that.

Barret calling Cloud pretty much cements the fact that Cloud couldn't logically have been gone for too long. Even if Barret didn't expect him to answer the phone, he clearly expected Marlene to get his message. So, uh, yeah.

Pointless point is made.
 
Neutron Ronnie

Neutron Ronnie

From The Front of Armament
AKA
Powerslave
Fairheartstrife said:
Pointless point is made.
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Not really pointless, it's a point against anti-Cloti, I think. It really does seem like he expects the message to get to Marlene.

But now I wonder why Barret didn't just call Marlene up and tell her himself?! I mean, the Seventh Heaven has a landline...
 
Tennyo

Tennyo

Higher Further Faster
Maybe Barret did call the bar but no one answered the phone? Maybe Barret wanted to have some man talk? Or maybe it was just a plot device to explain to us where he was and what he was doing and to also set up his return later on? ;)

But really, no one besides Tifa and the kids seemed to know that Cloud had left. Not even Rufus and the Turks realized this. I mean, if Cloud was really gone for so long people would know, and Rufus wouldn't have asked Cloud about the orphans that were living with him. Because, well, you know, Cloud wouldn't have been living with them anymore would he?
 
Fairheartstrife

Fairheartstrife

[no fucks given]
AKA
FHS, that cloti bitch
Tennyo said:
Maybe Barret did call the bar but no one answered the phone? Maybe Barret wanted to have some man talk? Or maybe it was just a plot device to explain to us where he was and what he was doing and to also set up his return later on? ;)

But really, no one besides Tifa and the kids seemed to know that Cloud had left. Not even Rufus and the Turks realized this. I mean, if Cloud was really gone for so long people would know, and Rufus wouldn't have asked Cloud about the orphans that were living with him. Because, well, you know, Cloud wouldn't have been living with them anymore would he?
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Exactly.

Another little tid-bit I picked up in that very brief message was how Barret said: "I'll be there soon" or something, but not: "I'll be HOME soon." Which completely debunks the Clerith argument that Barret still lives with them.

Not that I really saw where they pulled that from ( :loopy: ), but still...
 
DrakeClawfang

DrakeClawfang

The Wanderer of Time
Tennyo said:
But really, no one besides Tifa and the kids seemed to know that Cloud had left. Not even Rufus and the Turks realized this. I mean, if Cloud was really gone for so long people would know, and Rufus wouldn't have asked Cloud about the orphans that were living with him. Because, well, you know, Cloud wouldn't have been living with them anymore would he?
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To be fair, can you really see Rufus and the Turks calling Cloud up for coffee, asking him how things are going? More likely they were spying on him or something.

Cloud didn't even know Rufus was alive until AC/C, and Reno makes a point of asking Tifa if she remembers him. True, we don't hear his voice, her response is a good indication of what he says. Probably "hey babe, remember me?", or something like that. So up until AC/C, Shinra and Cloud and co didn't seem to have a lot of contact. Rufus and the Turks knew a lot more about Cloud than he did about them, though I have to wonder how they found that stuff out. Maybe Case of Shinra can clear that up.
 
Tennyo

Tennyo

Higher Further Faster
If the Turks were spying on him it would be all the more reason to know that he'd left.

Because really, if the Church was really Cloud's knew home then why wouldn't Reno and Rude just leave him here? lol

Okay maybe that last one is a stretch, but still. Reno and Rude obviously seem to think that Seventh Heaven is Cloud's home. They even ask, "Weren't there some kids living with you?" Well if Cloud didn't live there anymore why ask?
 
Isabella

Isabella

Your Mom
Discussion topic: What scenes in ACC portray Cloud and Tifa in a relationship?

For me, the best example is the bedroom scene. Their interactions are the kind you only see between two lovers who are at odds. Reno and Rude are aware of the private nature of the situation and get uncomfortable (comically). There's the focus on Tifa's ring as she slams her hand down.

Another is the constant focus on Tifa as Cloud makes his way out of his gloom. You'll notice all the reaction shots from her as Cloud defeats Bahamut, as he defeats Sephiroth, as he heals Denzel. It emphasizes that this is as much her journey as it is his, because their lives are so intertwined.

And another is actually about Denzel's reactions to Cloud's absence in ACC. Not about Tifa, true, but it shows the effect on the whole family structure of Cloud's leaving. He's portrayed like any boy whose "dad" has moved out and is blaming himself. There are plenty of instances of this family aspect.

Any others?
 
DrakeClawfang

DrakeClawfang

The Wanderer of Time
Isabella said:
For me, the best example is the bedroom scene. Their interactions are the kind you only see between two lovers who are at odds. Reno and Rude are aware of the private nature of the situation and get uncomfortable (comically). There's the focus on Tifa's ring as she slams her hand down.
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Focus on Tifa's ring? I always took that scene as showing her slamming her hand down to show her frustration, and she just happened to be wearing the ring. It's not like it's a wedding or an engagement ring or something, not something to focus a scene on. By that logic, let's discuss the camera's focus on Tifa's ass during her fight with Loz. :monster:
 
Isabella

Isabella

Your Mom
It's not an engagement ring, but it is a ring from Cloud, and it gets a closeup twice in the movie, both in "family" type moments. I don't think that's accidental.

What do you think the closeups mean, Drake, if not an emphasis on family?
 
DrakeClawfang

DrakeClawfang

The Wanderer of Time
Isabella said:
It's not an engagement ring, but it is a ring from Cloud, and it gets a closeup twice in the movie, both in "family" type moments. I don't think that's accidental.

What do you think the closeups mean, Drake, if not an emphasis on family?
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Did I say it's not an emphasis on family? Because it is, and more generally, it's a sign of connection between characters. Cloud, Tifa, Denzel and Marlene, the cast with the pink ribbon, Kadaj and his gang with the wings on their uniforms...
 
M

Madame Mayor

Banned
Shinra not knowing Cloud had left is more evidence that he hadn't been gone a long time, I would think.
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Doesn't Marlene also make it sound like he hasn't been gone for long? I don't remember exactly what she says, but she's wondering when he'll be back. If he'd been gone for months wouldn't they have already been used to him being gone for so long?

It's not an engagement ring, but it is a ring from Cloud, and it gets a closeup twice in the movie, both in "family" type moments. I don't think that's accidental.
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Don't they also emphasis it in the RF or an Ultimania somewhere? I was sure there was a picture of the zoomed in shot of Tifa's ring.
 
Tennyo

Tennyo

Higher Further Faster
DrakeClawfang said:
Yeah, they each have a wing etching on their uniform, of course you can't actually see them in the film so I don't know why they're there, but they're there nonetheless.

http://gallery.digik.net/view/25718
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lol I totally never noticed that before!

Also, I don't remember Marlene asking when Cloud will come back. However, in the church, after Tifa says they should leave and Marlene refuses, Tifa says, "So, say he comes back," to which Marlene replies, "We'll all go home!"

So according to Marlene Cloud's home is with them, not frolicking with Aerith in the flowers or curled up depressed in her church. It's at the bar.
 
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